[NetBehaviour] fail better

Sun Jan 15 17:55:37 CET 2012

Very very interesting that this has been commented on so much.
I suspect the reason is that this is a web based forum with  
contributers who have some stake in new media ie freakin boring  
computers (I say this as a one time street artist and latecomer to  
computers) and so when somebody picks up a paint brush it's like woo  
hoo how exotic.
Personally I still find the idea of programming a computer incredibly  
boring - however I give you guys some slack and say cool if you want  
to make code into poetry. To me a machine is merely an end to a  
means, in this case artistic expression.
Lets all paint paint paint - make a big bonfire of cameras - they  
were always a con ;)

Simon
On 15 Jan 2012, at 16:27, bob catchpole wrote:

> Michael,
>
> I disagree with John Baldessari. Painting and photography are  
> radically different picture-making processes - one is based on  
> synthesis and the other on selection. In a painting or drawing you  
> start with nothing and have to add. In photography you start with  
> everything and have to extract.
>
> Your drawing are strong because they capture something about you.
>
> Bob
>
> From: Michael Szpakowski <szpako at yahoo.com>
> To: NetBehaviour for networked distributed creativity  
> <netbehaviour at netbehaviour.org>
> Sent: Sunday, 15 January 2012, 15:11
> Subject: Re: [NetBehaviour] fail better
>
> Once again thanks for the interesting, helpful and encouraging  
> responses.
> I feel strangely the same when I point my camera at something and  
> when I do a sketch "in the moment" - I'm quite impressed by Patrick  
> Maynard's argument which seems to be that drawing and photography  
> are essentially both just processes of mark making....
> I think I could quite quickly produce you a photo of a unicorn  
> actually - I'm deeply sceptical about all the indexical , one-one  
> correspondence to reality - blather about photos. It was pretty  
> much never the defining feature ( ask Joe Stalin) and it certainly  
> isn't now.
> Moreover I'm not convinced that when I draw I'm any less a  
> "mechanism" of some kind for creating a kind of map of at least  
> some parts of reality than I am when I photograph (or remix photos  
> which is something I've been doing a lot). I'm with Baldessari who  
> scratched his head ( I'm dramatising of course and quoting from  
> memory here) and said he couldn't really see that much difference  
> between painting and photographs...
> Anyway, theory aside, that I should get such kind and helpful  
> feedback is one of the reasons I love netbehaviour :)
> warm wishes
> michael
>
> OK -just found it:
> John Baldessari : “A photograph and a painting are essentially the  
> same thing. One is just a series of pigments in emulsifier put down  
> on canvas, while the other is silver nitrate deposits put down on  
> paper. There is very little difference between the two.”
>
>
> From: Perry Bard <perrybard at gmail.com>
> To: NetBehaviour for networked distributed creativity  
> <netbehaviour at netbehaviour.org>
> Sent: Sunday, January 15, 2012 1:53 PM
> Subject: Re: [NetBehaviour] fail better
>
>
> Last night a philosopher friend Nick Pappas and I had this very  
> conversation-about the properties of photo vs painting and drawing.  
> WJT Mitchell in Intention and Artifice isolates an essential  
> difference- the referent adheres in a photo- you can paint a  
> unicorn but not photograph one (irrefutable, no?). Nick argued that  
> a camera is an object- you point and record, even if you make a  
> mistake or someone jostles your hand you record a specific moment  
> in time whereas a drawing records a moment in consciousness.
> Perry
>
> On Sun, Jan 15, 2012 at 8:19 AM, Annie Abrahams  
> <bram.org at gmail.com> wrote:
> I do think Michael you have a lot of formal technique - the way you  
> chose, frame and compose the image, the way you look at things is  
> very "sophisticated".
> I was wondering what for you makes these drawings so different from  
> your photos? Why do you want to do it?
> Is it a question of time? of attention?of meditation? of trying to  
> grasp something in a world too full of information?
> For me your drawings are full of time and
> they are brave
> I love to see them.
> Annie
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 15, 2012 at 1:56 PM, Rob Myers <rob at robmyers.org> wrote:
> On 14/01/12 17:00, Michael Szpakowski wrote:
> > thank-you Joel...
> > I don't honestly know how I expect people to react. I'm pretty  
> obsessed
> > at the moment...
> > I know that drawing is something I really want to keep doing.
> > warm wishes
> > michael
>
> You have a good eye for form, space and tone. As someone who's an
> enthusiastic rather than a competent draughtsperson I really admire  
> what
> you are doing here. Do keep doing!
>
> - Rob.
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>
> -- 
>
> Extrait en photo et son de la performance HUIS-CLOS / NO EXIT  
> Training for a Better World
> http://www.documentary-art.net/tag/watch-now.php?&ref=344
> Plus de photos :  http://www.flickr.com/photos/bramorg/sets/ 
> 72157628514083331/
>
> "Die Ewigkeit/ L'éternité", Antye GREIE / Annie ABRAHAMS - DUET -  
> SATZ 4  - Rêves / Utopia / Dreams http://vimeo.com/33907750
> http://www.bram.org
>
>
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> http://dziga.perrybard.net
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