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[Michael Szpakowski]

Ah ha! Misled by my relative ignorance of the specifics and the later reference to rap.. but... still my point stands... we lose something if we abandon wholesale physically actuated sound and the fragility of the live but wholesale dismissal of new musical practices is foolish, blunts our lives and experiences... fiercely critical openness seems to me the order of the day :)


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On Wednesday, December 4, 2019, 9:45 pm, Rob Myers <rob at robmyers.org> wrote:

Grimes -
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miss_Anthropocene

I’m a big fan of all three but for very different reasons.
- Rob.
On Wed, Dec 4, 2019 at 1:13 PM, Michael Szpakowski <m at michaelszpakowski.org> wrote:
 Do you mean Grime Simon? I’m unclear. I think there is a big difference between a healthy scepticism and nuanced discussion about how tech can on occasion be ill used and the dismissal of whole swathes of work...


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On Wednesday, December 4, 2019, 6:36 pm, Simon Mclennan via NetBehaviour <netbehaviour at lists.netbehaviour.org> wrote:

Have to weigh in in this! Grimes. Sorry. Yes — Grimes. Utterly soulless product without anything of cultural value to me, musical or otherwise. This discussion between these three entities makes me yawn. It’s all about money - absolutely nothing else - it’s the equivalent of Smash powdered potatoes - worse than that. These people are completely without musical talent - the so-name AI is less than the dirt under the nails of the Ed Blackwell. Technology is only about generating revenue. It does not help musicians - rap is a festering sore on the ass of the bourgeoisie. An undeniable itch - when scratched and cauterised momentarily it oozes some wealth for a tiny few participants. Sorry I rarely contribute to this list - and I dig you cats for keeping the stuff rumbling along the conveyor / keep it up and — where’s my Jazzmaster and homemade inks....

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On 28 Nov 2019, at 18:11, Alan Sondheim via NetBehaviour <netbehaviour at lists.netbehaviour.org> wrote:


It's definitely a discussion we need to have. It reminds me of a dinner I had years ago w/ Cage who confirmed he criticized jazz because the player worked with fixed rhythms. Something gets lost in these discussions; Adorno fails miserably.Ah well... It relates to my writing about 'somatic ghosting' I think. And I always feel I have to justify myself (although the audience doesn't feel it) when I show up playing an acoustic guitar for example. -- Alan

On Thu, Nov 28, 2019 at 1:06 PM Rob Myers <rob at robmyers.org> wrote:

On 2019-11-27 7:40 p.m., Alan Sondheim wrote:
>> This sounds so white/privileged to me, the position
> of the listener paramount for example, the relegation of community to
> reproduction, etc. It's a form of hip effacement. I realize I haven't
> read everything HH's has written, but there's a fundamental difference
> between a drum machine and a "great drummer" who came from community,
> breathes within community, and contributes to community. Thinking for
> example of free jazz, and the difficulties and explorations of the great
> players, the relation of that music to the cry, the field holler, the
> blues, gospel musics, etc. 

I think HH would agree with you.

> and I keep returning to white white white white white and privilege.
There is something class-bound about Grimes (currently dating a
billionaire) and HH (whose last album was their PhD thesis) arguing
about who the future will be worse for. But I suspect that our own
reactions can be similarly reduced to our respective identities.

There's obviously a bigger historical discussion about race, technology,
intellectual property and music that AI and "AI" are just the latest
phase of. Drum machines being prominent in rap and techno and disdain
for them as tools may be related, for example. Given this, I'm genuinely
surprised that AI has been instantly mainstreamed in music in the way
that it seems to have. More like the Fairlight than the 808...

- Rob.



-- 
=====================================================directory http://www.alansondheim.org tel 718-813-3285
email sondheim ut panix.com, sondheim ut gmail.com
=====================================================

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