[NetBehaviour] response to lists.

pl at voyd.com pl at voyd.com
Fri Jun 4 21:35:31 CEST 2021


The "little bit" just a friendly aphorism voiced in Arabic tact.
And I know this - your asking this is essential, honestly.

My question was more in the area of whether we are more willing to be passive. I know this life is a lot of work.

On Fri, 4 Jun 2021 15:21:32 -0400, Alan Sondheim via NetBehaviour <netbehaviour at lists.netbehaviour.org> wrote:


Hi, a few points,


I'm not sure why you say "the little part Alan and I have in common" - I think we have a lot, but I may be wrong.

With empyre, the situation is very different; it's a moderated, subject-oriented list with guest moderators and other guests; it's been incredibly useful to me, But it seems to me that Netbehaviour really isn't moderated in a very deep way (that also parallels the two lists I run btw); people can say what they want and the conversations cover any number of topics. I was thrilled when Annie and Johannes asked me about my practice, and I'm thrilled as well with the conversations here in general.

In other words, Netbehaviour is a form of commons; it's more like Occupy than a symposium (although there were symposia at Occupy, and there are symposia and resources announced and referenced on Netbehaviour).

Again, I think the beauty of this particular commons is its openness; the moderation is a kind of a-moderation.

In that sense it reminds me of the old newsgroups which were very often open with loose topics, but it's better because we don't have trolls etc. It's a remarkable space.

You say also "I think Alan opened up a useful conversation, although he does this at times when things get quiet as I remember at least two or three other similar prompts." - I'm not sure why "although" - since when the list is busy, there's no reason to reconsider the dynamics of the list. The same thing has happened on other lists with other people raising similar issues, and since I post daily here, I worry about being or becoming a nuisance, rather than a valued project of sorts.


Best, Alan


Best, Alan


On Fri, Jun 4, 2021 at 2:47 PM <pl at voyd.com> wrote:

Hello, everyone.
My partner in all things, Negin Ehtesabian and I just finished moderating the month at Empyre, which was a challenge as I had been in a different noospace in Arabia for the past 5 years, and it has been a bit of a shock re-entering, and not for any reasons you might think. Or might.

I think Alan opened up a useful conversation, although he does this at times when things get quiet as I remember at least two or three other similar prompts. 

But I think it's so different this time is the outpouring of support, or proportionally cell, for the conversation. On empire I found it hard, I'll be at May, to get a lot of participation, and I have heard the commentary of colleagues saying that they had been watching but not participating. When talking about this list, I think the responses have been really interesting. It's obvious that we value this list. The question is to what position do each of us place ourselves in; producer or consumer - the issue is that it seems that most of us are largely in the consumer area, because we are simply overwhelmed with so many different types of media. 

It also seems to me that a number of moderators of the traditional list serves want to turn it over to someone else at this point, because the lists have become less active, and I think that this is unavoidable, but I also think that a little bit of a change in vision may be in order. In the case of empyre Renate wants to actually not hand it over to anyone else but to shut it down, which I honestly think is a crime. However, I think that a lot of these sorts of spaces have become discords, and that's a whole other conversation.

Also with the upcoming generations I realize that list serves seem really anachronistic, but I also see them as one of the few places in which a more direct non-branded approach to social interaction as possible, and I think that is incredibly important.

Of course, there are a few critical issues in play; what are our roles within this list, and who wants to be responsible for community? Personally, I would beseech Ruth and Marc to please try to stay with it for 6 to 12 more months and enter a more direct dialogue about this. Although I have been much more of a lurker in my time in Arabia, I am still a staunch supporter of this particular group, in bed I put most of my support behind it when I decided to be less active in rhizome because I felt that their support of community had largely fallen away. I know that we are all moving on in our lives a bit, using a bit of Arabian tact, but I still think that this community is tremendously necessary.

However like most of us I currently do not have the resources in the short term to take over the list. However, I do have resources at my disposal that could possibly work that out in the long run but I can't make any promises.

The one thing that Alan and Johannes made very good points about is the sharing of our work and announcements and so on. This has dried up a lot in the last few years, and I think this is something to take note. It's fine if we promote a little bit or if we share our work or get some feedback I think this is great. In the end art is about sharing and giving mutual support, and I think that later generations may look at this as being self-promotional when it doesn't necessarily have to be. Enough of that.

As my partner Negin has been encouraging me to do, I have been trying to re-emerge into the community  more because the immediate, direct influence of American politics upon my life has been a weight. As with all the communities we inhabit the goal is as much to share the work but also to give support and care to everyone surrounding us in this community or any other. For now comma I will try to share more and talk more and be less of a consumer, and I hope that others will too. However as I grow older, comma I will try to share more and talk more and be less of a consumer, and I hope that others will too. However as I grow older, I wrestle more with my hidden disabilities which I learned a great deal more about a couple years ago, and see what's the best way forward is, and that is mainly the reason why I just don't jump up and say let me help run the list, this might be a possibility at another time but not now.

In ending, I will let the little part Alan and I have in common in saying that I hope that this message is well met and that you all are doing well. I will do whatever I can to help.


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